Rep. Gordon (Chairman): It's "costing the entertainment industry billions of dollars and thousands of jobs"  Not just about money but about bandwidth.  Teaching students it's alright to steal.  Third committee to hold hearings but they focused on policy issues; this one focuses on technology.  Comparison to anti-virus and anti-spam technologies: not perfect but effective.  "Can't rely on laws and regulations alone to fix the problem."  "I don't want to be holding the same hearing in the 111th Congress."

Rep. Hill (ranking member?): Will call a hearing in the 111th if necessary.  Same stuff...

Rep. Sensenbrenner: Directed Smith to hold hearings last year to hold copyright hearings.  100% solution not possible.  Stanford alumnus; visited campus several years ago and was told that ~80% of bandwidth was for P2P.  Those costs are driving up tuition costs.

Wight:  Respect for copyright lies at the heart of what we do.  2 pronged approach at University of Utah: (a) monitor bandwidth for "top talkers" and (b) Audible Magic on ResNet and (c) 2 gig limit per day.  DMCA notices reduced by more than 90%; only 2-3 notices per week.  Saved 1.2 billion per year in bandwidth reductions and 70k in personnel costs for copyright abuse investigations.  Valid complaints require the user to agree to the AUP in writing.  Repeat offenses low; only 3 users whose access was permanently revoked.  No 100% solution so multiple strategies must be employed.  Unviersity must personally contact each accused user and evaluate the situation.

Sannier:  Despite popular media reports, ASU's complaint rate (DMCA takedown notices) is low.  ASU was an "early adopter" of RIAA's four recommended strategies: education, alternative (online entertainment service - Ruckus), appropriate disciplinary action, and technical network restriction(s).  First technical solution, in December 2000, was packetshaping.  Later moved to Audible Magic.  Immediately began rejecting 5-10% of network traffic.  List price is just over $200,000.  Concerned about ongoing arms race.  Therefore, we applaud the market advances.

Ikezoye:  Our product allows us to "automate the education process..."  Over 80 customers worldwide with 70 of them (higher?) education.  P2P is not the problem - copyright infringement is.  Local musicians could "designate" their content to be freely distributed.  No 100% solution.

Elzy:  Summary of DCP.  Talked to everyone, including EFF. :)  Goal is to provide a "Consumers Report"-style evaluation of approaches for higher education.  Funding is also difficult to find for this project.  Project was funded for 18 months and we're already 5 months into it.  Monitoring technologies not ready to do what Congress wants it to do.  Technology is not *the* answer.

Jackson:  University's business centers on intellectual property.  Access is essential as is "the right balance" between protection and access.  2nd DMCA offenders fined $1000.  6 repeat offenders over 5 years.  Business needs drive infringement; media industry serves consumers "inconsistently, incompatably, inefficiently, inconveniently, and incompletely."  Network filtering/monitoring fails on high-performance networks.  Social, rather than technical, tools are the only answer.

Rep. Gordon:  Jackson, you said the filtering technologies would fail.  Have you tested them?

Jackson:  No.

Rep. Gordon: Dumbass.  If technical measures are ineffective, why do you employ anti-virus and anti-spam?

Jackson:   First, they work.  If we can find filtering tools that are as effective, we'd use them.  Second, it's taken years to effect social change.

Rep. Gordon:  Arms race?

Ikezoye:  P2P developers are smart and challenging.  But we're evolving, too.  Anti-virus and anti-spam analogies are good.

Rep. Gordon:  Technology can't be installed on every computer.

Elzy:  Huh?

Rep. Gordon:  Is it mostly ResNet?

Elzy: Yup.

Rep. Gordon:  So it's cheaper to concentrate on ResNet?

Elzy:  Yup.

Rep. Hill:  Do y'all agree that technology can't solve it all?  Technology is an important part of a solution?

All:  Yes and yes.

Rep. Hill:  Do the collaborative groups (DCP and Joint Committee) provide the info necessary?

Jackson:  They're on the right path.

Rep. Hill:  Will there ever be a technology that is completely effective?

Jackson:  No.

Rep. Hill:  Are you making progress in this area?

Sannier:  Yes.  It's an evolving issue.  The industry is making progress.  DRM-free music is the greatest innovation in this area.

Rep. Hill:  Elzy?

Elzy:  Yes.  We've talked to people who haven't been talked to before.  Media industry is taking a higher interest in this issue with increasing use of signatures.  Tracking systems must become more accurate.

Rep. Hill:  Should we spend as much as necessary to stop the piracy?  But I won't ask about where the money is going to come from since y'all know the answer to that.

Rep. McNerney:  Wight, your approach (technology used to its ability with people backing it up) seems common.  Do you get the adequate cooperation from those people?

Wight:  It's run out of our security office and it's a part-time responsibility so it's not a problem.

Rep. McNerney:  Do you cut off someone immediately if they exceed their limit?

Wight:  Yes.  Then we follow up with them.  Only twice have we cut off students inappropriately (they were using VOIP).

Rep. McNerney:  Does Ruckus interoperate and meet the need?

Sannier:  No, it's still got DRM.  Services we can purchase still don't meet demand.

Rep. McNerney:  So you use a carrot and stick approach?

Sannier:  Yes.

Rep. McNerney:  How many packets does Copy Sense need to analyze to identify a file?

Ikezoye:  20-30 seconds worth of music or movie.  Afterwards, it only takes a few packets.

Rep. Feeney:  I'm also on the Judiciary Committee.  This is the third committee to hold this hearing and we take it seriously.  Education alone can not solve the problem.  I'm disappointed that some of you have minimalized the role of technology.  You educate students not to commit crimes but you still lock your doors.  Judiciary Committee will not patient for long with universities that have not been aggressive.  UF has saved money by implementing a technical solution.  Whaddya say, Jackson and Elzy?  Should we keep giving you money if you're not protecting copyrights?

Jackson:  We do use technology - firewalls, packeteer (until it failed), etc.  The technologies that protect the network must not interfere with it.  The current technologies simply don't work.

Elzy:  Technology is not a 100% answer.  Relying on technology too much will harm our other efforts.  Distance ed and library uses can not be blocked.  Legal services must get up to speed.  Anecdote: a recent group of students in a focus group couldn't name a single legit service.

Rep. Wilson:  Ohio University has implemented an "innovative" solutions.  How do you communicate with one another?

Jackson:  Joint Committee.  EDUCAUSE.  "We trade notes all the time."  FERPA makes it difficult for us to publicize incidents.

Rep. Wilson:  Good.  Just making sure that you're talking to one another.

Rep. Gingrey:  We didn't buy all of the comics when I was a kid and it's not too different from what kids are doing today with music and movies.  But you can't completely solve this problem with technology.  If you "scare the Bejeezus out of them" and "appeal to their sense of fair play" you can make some progress.  But they arrive on campus having done this from a young age.  Wight, how are copyrighted works used in coursework?

Wight:  They're used a lot as allowed by fair use.  TEACH Act expanded our abilities to use copyrighted works.

Sannier:  Fair use is very important.  "If we were to allow stringent enforcement of copyright to erode fair use, the country as a whole would be much the worse for it."

Rep. Gingrey:  You're right - my comic book analogy does break down when brought online.